Bullet points.

[pauraque_bk]

-Happy birthday, fluffyllama!

-Re: HBP. idlerat is right about the wank, and amanuensis1 is right about the book. [Spoilers, of course.]

-vejgurl is doing chapter-by-chapter HBP commentary, so if you like that sort of thing, check it out.

-More Death Eater cards from appleviking! Igor Karkaroff and Walden Macnair.

-I happened to see some non-fandom people in some forum talking about HBP, and noticed something interesting: They hated Chapter 2. It ruined the book, they said, because it gave away so far in advance that Snape was evil. It hadn't occurred to them that Snape might not be evil. This really drove home for me why Snape has to be Good -- if he isn't, what's Chapter 2 for? Yes, I know people have pointed this out already, but I think the sheer idiocy of Chapter 2 (assuming an evil Snape) was masked for me by how entertaining the chapter is if you're in fandom. Casual readers understand this more easily... but they tend to think that JKR just did bad, rather than that she's bluffing us.

-Icon.



Before the tooth-gnashing starts -- I didn't add the tinytext, and I don't know what it says. It was part of the model I was using:

Comments

[woolf.livejournal.com]

Robin finished the book over the weekend, and it was really interesting for me to talk with him about it. He's read them all and really loves the series, but he's totally not involved with fandom. He, too, was convinced that Snape was now totally evil--which has me now equally convinced that we're all right and Snape's just misunderstood. :P

Of course, he also jumped immediately to RAB=Regulus Black. This has me alternating between being incredibly proud of his acumen, and really worried that we collectively made that jump way too quickly and are all going to be really surprised when it turns out to be Mr. Borgin or something.

[pauraque]

The only thing that has somewhat quelled my grumbling about the end of the book is the idea that Harry needs to think Snape is evil for the plot of Book 7 to work. Which still makes HBP an unsatisfactory novel, in my opinion, but at least would explain things.

[idlerat.livejournal.com]

Two (very heavily friended) people on my flist in a row, in about 5 minutes, just linked two different posts of mine. I think that's a first.

That's a good point about how differently chapter 2 reads, but I'm afraid I don't see how that's a mistake on Jo's part. You mean it says she's not in control of how the narrative will be read?

[pauraque]

I take it you're responding to this:

Casual readers understand this more easily... but tend to think that JKR just did bad, rather than that she's bluffing us.

I'm contrasting two interpretations here.

Casual reader: It sure was stupid of JKR to give away the surprise of Snape being evil so early in the book. [This is something I overheard a casual reader say, not my own opinion.]

Fandom reader: JKR is bluffing, Snape isn't evil.

Does that make sense?

[idlerat.livejournal.com]

Oh oh I misread what you wrote. D'oh. I thought you said "*I* tend to think."

I ship Remus/Sirius because I don't know how to read! :D

Anvil!

[pauraque]

I've added a helpful they to the offending sentence. Now even the most delusional Harry/Hermione shipper can understand! ^_^

We're kidding.

[muridae-x.livejournal.com]

My casual reader (my mother) finished the book at the weekend. She is very definitely not in the fandom, since the internet is just something she logs on to every few days to check for email.

Her opinion was definitely that there was more to the Snape situation than meets the eye just yet, and that there were more reversals to come in book seven. Though we didn't mention chapter two in particular, I suspect that means that her reading of it is much the same as ours.

[fluffyllama.livejournal.com]

Thank you for the birthday wishes!

[dailyplanet.livejournal.com]

I'm reading it with some kiddies. Nobody thinks Snape is evil (yet). They have been conditioned to believe the opposite of what Harry thinks, thanks to the previous books and their tricksy endings!

[dailyplanet.livejournal.com]

PS: I think I'd be relieved if a lot of people thought Snape WAS evil, because then I wouldn't feel like it's so obvious he's NOT evil, and then I wouldn't feel so annoyed with all the bright adult characters in the book who haven't also figured out the obvious (to me, the obvious, I mean).

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

I'm actually a little relieved that some people believe Snape's evil, because I was gawping at how obvious it seemed--but it looks like Rowling knew her audience, and knew there would be debate! Yowza. So that, to me, makes the book more successful as a result. (Even if the Snape Is Evil people are wrong, heh.)

[dailyplanet.livejournal.com]

YES hopefully people still can be fooled!!

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

Hee, I'm even happier that you're siding with idlerat about the wank than I am about you siding with me about the romance! XD

[sistermagpie.livejournal.com]

I thought Snape was not evil too, actually. It seemed like things were pointing that way--I almost expected it to be revealed by the end of the book.

I mean, otherwise the message of the books seems to be that you shouldn't see good in people which is, uh, strange. The fact that people kept saying that was Dumbledore's worst flaw made me think it had to be his greatest strength. It was only after reading reactions I thought Snape could be working for Voldemort.

The wank is really irritating me recently. I find myself not commenting on things because people are watching to jump on it if you say the wrong thing. Since when is not liking something in a book, or not liking the book itself wanky? Enough with the enforcing of opinions already.

[slinkhard.livejournal.com]

God yes. I actually enjoyed HBP, but I'd never begrudge someone disliking it (especially since disliking OotP, which I thought was an abysmal book was verboten at the time, iirc) and I hate the double standard of 'If you don't like what you're reading, don't read it!' followed by 'Nanny boo hoo, everyone's ripping it apart and killing my joy!' Then, um, don't go on the internet, genius.

[sistermagpie.livejournal.com]

Yeah. I liked a lot of the book (and boy was I surprised--I went into it dreading the worst) and disliked other parts. It's weird, because after OotP, which I really hated reading, I sought out negative reviews because I liked reading those. This time I still find myself seeking out negative reviews. Sure I've read some criticisms I didn't think held up, but not with most of them. I'm going to rip the book apart whether I liked it or not, really, so it pisses me off to have people stifling intelligent discussion about it because it sounds negative or saying not liking something in the book means you're just a baby who didn't get your ship validated or something.

That's kind of what I was saying here in my long-winded way.

I've resigned myself to the fact that I'm always going to be killing somebody's joy in fandom. I'm a joy-killer by nature. It is not my abilities to pull apart the text that shows who I am, but my choice to do it.

[slinkhard.livejournal.com]

Yes, me too. I just find negative reviews more interesting, I think. There's always more issues to be chewed over, whereas there's only so many ways you can chew over 'The Slytherins rocked in this book; what are the horcruxes; what about Snape, huh?' no matter how much fun I found reading it.

It is not my abilities to pull apart the text that shows who I am, but my choice to do it.

Hee!

[eponis.livejournal.com]

I wonder how much has to do with the people, not just being in-fandom vs. out-of-fandom. An adult friend of mine who's uninvolved with fandom (and has only read each other book once) said that he had no doubt that Snape was not-evil, before I could say anything about it. I mean, forget fandom and wanting to redeem Snape or whatever; he and I thought it was obvious, reading it purely as a book that's more than a child's tale of good-vs-bad.