I suppose what makes it weird for me is that they all lived with each other for seven years. That's a long time for a set pattern of interaction...
Like I said, the fixation would have developed gradually over a long time, and needn't have been obvious as it was happening. I like the idea that he becomes more demonstrative because he sees Lily as a rival, consciously or not. (I believe Peter largely *doesn't* do these things consciously -- I doubt that he's ever spent much time on self-examination.)
And James, who perhaps would have found it awkward otherwise, has a newfound need for recognition that he's just not getting from the person who truly wants to recognize him, Lily.
This is interesting; I hadn't really looked at it from James's point of view. He does show a certain insecurity where Lily is concerned, and the continual rejection must have hurt. This makes it look even worse for Peter when Lily finally did take to James -- if James was seeking Peter's affection as a substitute for Lily's, then when he had Lily's he wouldn't have needed Peter's anymore.
He'll tease James but not really hold him accountable for his obsessions.
True, but I don't think that's out of deference to James. Sirius's response to all three of his friends seems to be careless and inattentive, varying in degree rather than kind -- he makes a cruel remark at Peter's adulation, brushes Remus off for his studiousness, and casually mocks James for his infatuation. But he doesn't harp on it -- not with any of them -- he just tosses off a comment and moves on, restlessly searching for something more interesting. He mocks their flaws, but doesn't hold any of them *accountable* for them.
My interpretation of the OotP scene was that it was James taking out his frustration on Snape, and Sirius just went along with it because it was fun and he was bored. James is the one who made the decision, who got the true satisfaction out of torturing someone.
My interpretation was just the opposite. James makes that decision because he think it will please Sirius ("This'll liven you up, Padfoot.") James does seems to be having fun -- but what I felt from Sirius was cold sadism.
Look at what James says to Snape:
-"All right, Snivellus?" said James loudly. -"How'd the exam go, Snivelly?" said James -"Wash out your mouth," said James coldly.
These remarks are mocking, but not extraordinarily cruel.
And then look at Sirius:
-Sirius's head turned. He became very still, like a dog that has scented a rabbit. -"I was watching him, his nose was touching the parchment," said Sirius viciously. "There'll be great grease marks all over it, they won't be able to read a word." -"Wait for what?" said Sirius coolly. "What're you going to do, Snivelly, wipe your nose on us?"
Sirius's taunts are "cool" and "vicious". They're also very *specific* -- tailored to Snape, rather than just general mockery. And there's that description, likening him to a predator stalking its prey... Unlike James, Sirius isn't just having some careless fun -- he's intent on causing as much humiliation as possible. Torturing Snape is serious business to him.
This is why I see Sirius as the leader. James may have instigated this particular incident, but in general, it's Sirius's cruelty that's the driving force.
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Date: 2003-08-29 11:55 pm (UTC)Like I said, the fixation would have developed gradually over a long time, and needn't have been obvious as it was happening. I like the idea that he becomes more demonstrative because he sees Lily as a rival, consciously or not. (I believe Peter largely *doesn't* do these things consciously -- I doubt that he's ever spent much time on self-examination.)
And James, who perhaps would have found it awkward otherwise, has a newfound need for recognition that he's just not getting from the person who truly wants to recognize him, Lily.
This is interesting; I hadn't really looked at it from James's point of view. He does show a certain insecurity where Lily is concerned, and the continual rejection must have hurt. This makes it look even worse for Peter when Lily finally did take to James -- if James was seeking Peter's affection as a substitute for Lily's, then when he had Lily's he wouldn't have needed Peter's anymore.
He'll tease James but not really hold him accountable for his obsessions.
True, but I don't think that's out of deference to James. Sirius's response to all three of his friends seems to be careless and inattentive, varying in degree rather than kind -- he makes a cruel remark at Peter's adulation, brushes Remus off for his studiousness, and casually mocks James for his infatuation. But he doesn't harp on it -- not with any of them -- he just tosses off a comment and moves on, restlessly searching for something more interesting. He mocks their flaws, but doesn't hold any of them *accountable* for them.
My interpretation of the OotP scene was that it was James taking out his frustration on Snape, and Sirius just went along with it because it was fun and he was bored. James is the one who made the decision, who got the true satisfaction out of torturing someone.
My interpretation was just the opposite. James makes that decision because he think it will please Sirius ("This'll liven you up, Padfoot.") James does seems to be having fun -- but what I felt from Sirius was cold sadism.
Look at what James says to Snape:
-"All right, Snivellus?" said James loudly.
-"How'd the exam go, Snivelly?" said James
-"Wash out your mouth," said James coldly.
These remarks are mocking, but not extraordinarily cruel.
And then look at Sirius:
-Sirius's head turned. He became very still, like a dog that has scented a rabbit.
-"I was watching him, his nose was touching the parchment," said Sirius viciously. "There'll be great grease marks all over it, they won't be able to read a word."
-"Wait for what?" said Sirius coolly. "What're you going to do, Snivelly, wipe your nose on us?"
Sirius's taunts are "cool" and "vicious". They're also very *specific* -- tailored to Snape, rather than just general mockery. And there's that description, likening him to a predator stalking its prey... Unlike James, Sirius isn't just having some careless fun -- he's intent on causing as much humiliation as possible. Torturing Snape is serious business to him.
This is why I see Sirius as the leader. James may have instigated this particular incident, but in general, it's Sirius's cruelty that's the driving force.