rec :: more on Peter and the map

[pauraque_bk]

I saved scribbulus_ink's orgy fic "Bottoms Up" [NC-17, Remus/Severus/Bill/Harry/Neville/Draco you heard me] until all six parts were posted, and what a treat it turned out to be! The premise first looks like a study in cliché -- stormbound in the middle of nowhere, getting drunk, playing Truth or Dare -- but it works because scribbulus_ink throws herself into it with such gleeful panache. Funny, a little silly, a lot sexy. Drunk!Remus and eager!Neville steal the show. A definite recommendation.

---

A summary of ideas put forth on the matter of why Fred and George didn't see Peter on the map (this topic got somewhat buried by the more exciting YA lit discussion):

1. They'd already memorized the map by then. (ellid)
- But Scabbers belonged to Percy first. (notthatjaded)

2. They thought he was a kid in Ron's year. (threeoranges)
- Again, he belonged to Percy first.
- Also, Peter's 'murder' seems to be common knowledge.

3. They thought he was a ghost. (ellid)
- Do ghosts appear on the map? [EDIT: Peeves does.]

4. When Ron was carrying him in his pocket, Peter's name wasn't visible. (ellid)
- Not sure why that would be.

5. "...you need to be looking for certain people, or at least have them in mind, when you are using the map in order for them to show up. Otherwise, everyone in the castle would show up every time Harry used the map, and that's not the case." (gmth)
- But Remus saw Peter when he wasn't looking for him. (maidenjedi)
- But he was thinking about his old friends that night. (gmth)

6. "My hypothesis is that it shows you who/what you need to see, rather than necessarily who you want to see. That would explain things like Harry spotting Crouch in GoF." (vvvexation)

7. JKR fouled up!


roxannelinton also noted:

Someone made an interesting point somewhere that after Ginny's experience with an object that 'you can't see where it keeps it's brain'; Fred and George were quick to dispose of the map, although not to *their* family members. Which is a rather cynical view of Fred and George, but imho, perfectly in character.

---

A friend of mine at work brought in a box of Bertie Botts beans today. Being a hopeless Gryffindor, she tried a vomit-flavored one, and very much regretted it. I gamely partook of all varieties but that one... the black pepper was pretty good. The soap was unpleasantly realistic. Of course, nothing can top my most hated of Jelly Bellies, the dreaded Buttered Popcorn. *shudder*

---

isiscolo coined a great term today. BMF: Big Mouth Fan. That, I can certainly declare myself.

Comments

[alchemine.livejournal.com]

I agree with vvvexation's no. 6 -- since the map's designed to help mischief-makers avoid trouble, maybe it only shows people who are likely to cause trouble for the person using it. When Harry first used it, he saw Dumbledore, Mrs. Norris, Filch and Peeves, all of whom could have been bad news for his escape. (Dumbledore does let Harry do dangerous things, but he wouldn't want Harry sneaking out and getting killed or having his soul removed, since he wouldn't be very useful as an anti-Voldemort weapon after that.) When Harry used the map later, he saw Neville, who went on to mess things up by stopping him to talk, and Snape, who would leap at the chance to get him in trouble. By that logic, since Peter probably didn't care what Fred and George did as long as it didn't involve him, he didn't show up on the map for them -- but did show up for Remus, because he was personally invested in Remus's movements around the castle.

[pauraque]

Good point. I think this is the right track.

[vvvexation.livejournal.com]

Peter's 'murder' seems to be common knowledge.

Maybe not among the younger generation, though. After all, Ron had never heard of the Dark Mark until GoF; it's possible this was another thing that wasn't spoken of much after it happened.

[pauraque]

Could be. In the Shrieking Shack, Remus says to Ron, "didn't you ever hear", all that was left of Pettigrew was his finger, which implied that it was common knowledge. Then again, maybe Ron didn't know after all.

[vvvexation.livejournal.com]

Well, I just now checked and it was in fact Ron who first told Harry that (in chapter 11); he said his dad told him, but I imagine probably not till just that summer. Stan and Ernie mentioned Black had killed "a wizard" along with a dozen Muggles, so that part was apparently common knowledge but mayyyyybe the identity of the wizard wasn't. Or maybe I'm just talking out of my ass at this point. *rueful grin*

[pauraque]

Well, I don't have the book on me, but now that I think about it, I think the overheard conversation among the adults may imply that Peter's name wasn't generally known. That seems a bit odd, actually, since the wizarding world seems to like celebrities -- Harry's name is certainly known, as is Sirius's. Then again, maybe just getting murdered isn't enough to gain notoriety.

[exbentley]

"My hypothesis is that it shows you who/what you need to see, rather than necessarily who you want to see. That would explain things like Harry spotting Crouch in GoF."
And also the 'Dissendium' thing, in the books, where Harry sees himself doing what he needs to on the map, which didn't happen until he needed to do them.

When Ron was carrying him in his pocket, Peter's name wasn't visible.
This seems applicable if we take movie canon, as the little nametag thingies may have overlapped each other.

Also, if Fred and George got the map in their first year ("nicked it off Filch" and gave it to Harry in their third year, then they only had it for one year, and perhaps during that time they never watched Ron on the map when he had Scabbers with him (remember he seems to run off quite a bit.)

And maybe Peter can make himself invisible to the map, at least while he's at Hogwarts, since he's part of the creation, and (disincluding the movie-verse) when he gets very excited towards the end of the book because he feels he's escaping he fails to do whatever it is he needs to or lets his defences relax; so up until then he'd not been marked on it.

This leads me along to train of thought such as Peter the Occulemens, and I've enough fics to write without adding another idea to my collection! *stops pondering*

[pauraque]

And maybe Peter can make himself invisible to the map, at least while he's at Hogwarts, since he's part of the creation

That's not a bad idea either.

This leads me along to train of thought such as Peter the Occulemens

Now, this opens up some interesting avenues. If he were an Occlumens, that would explain how Dumbledore didn't know he was the spy. Voldemort seems to read Peter pretty easily, but it could be that Peter was letting him, or was too emotionally overwrought to shield himself (as you suggest with the map).

It's also intriguing that the Occlumency/Legilimency experts we know of (Snape, Dumbledore, Voldemort) seem to have terrible social skills -- crippled empathy. Peter would make an interesting addition to that group.

[vvvexation.livejournal.com]

Mmmph. You'd think that, while Occlumency would tend to cripple one's empathy, Legilimency would do the opposite.

[pauraque]

I wasn't necessarily thinking that Occlumency/Legilimency (they seem to go hand in hand) actually damage one's empathy, but perhaps that poor empathy ironically enhances one's ability to learn those skills. A very empathetic person might be reluctant to break into someone's private thoughts, and equally reluctant to cut off their own feelings from others.

[vvvexation.livejournal.com]

Ah, right. That does make sense.

[pauraque]

remember he seems to run off quite a bit

Does he? Like when?

[vvvexation.livejournal.com]

and gave it to Harry in their third year

His third year, their fifth.

[slinkhard.livejournal.com]

When in doubt, don't fanwank, just blame it on JKR!
Seriously, I feel all BNFish now I've been quoted! Thanks ;)

[pauraque]

Heheh. Well, it was just "declare yourself a BNF day"...

[vvvexation.livejournal.com]

*laughingly admits to feeling similar*

[pauraque]

Haha! Like my noticing you confers some kind of BNF status? You guys are gonna give me a swelled head! :D

[vvvexation.livejournal.com]

And then we'll all get to feel like BNFs. See, it works!

[nakedcelt.livejournal.com]

How about: "Scabbers" lived in Gryffindor Tower, and the twins already knew their way around Gryffindor Tower, so they never bothered to look there?

[nakedcelt.livejournal.com]

Thought of this just after I clicked "Post Comment" for the last one: The real question is: Does the Chamber of Secrets show up on the Map?

[pauraque]

I think the implication is that the map only shows places MWPP had been or knew about. This would differ from the magic that shows where people are, which of course does reveal more than the boys knew (that's the whole point).

[neotoma.livejournal.com]

6. "My hypothesis is that it shows you who/what you need to see, rather than necessarily who you want to see. That would explain things like Harry spotting Crouch in GoF." (vvvexation)


I think this is by far the most viable explanation, especially considering that the Map did a little animated cartoon to show Harry the password to get into the tunnel to Honeydukes! There's definitely a brain (or four) in there.

Which is a rather cynical view of Fred and George, but imho, perfectly in character.

Anyone who trusts Fred and George with *anything* should be prepared to be pranked. I don't really trust them not to screw things up majorly because they think they are going to have 'a bit of fun' in the course of the Order's efforts to defeat Voldemort.

But if you want to see someone who *really* doesn't have a chipper view of the Twins, look through ajhalluk's Potter posts.

BTW, is that link right? It seems to be a post about "Gay Characters in YA fiction", not about the Map at all, unless the relevant bit is buried in the comments.

[pauraque]

I asked about Peter and the map at the very top of the post, and then rambled about YA lit. A few people addressed the Peter question, but it did get buried in the large number of comments.

[kragey.livejournal.com]

Ah, the beans! In a crowded car, driving about the waterfront shops in North Carolina, my best friend, my twin brother and I all shared a box. We managed to swallow all but one bean: the vomit-flavoured. The spaghetti was pretty hard and I loath the soap, but the vomit? We spit them out the windows.

Personally, I enjoyed the cinnamon and the lemon drop, although Chach (best friend) hogged the blueberry. T_T

And for now, I'm gonna go for a mix of theories 5 and 6.

[ellid.livejournal.com]

My one experience with Bertie Bott's Beans involved a vomit flavored one. Awful, just awful. And I truly pity the poor fools who have to *taste test* the things....